Aaron Walker of View From The Top and Iron Sharpens Iron talks to us about his experiences running mastermind groups. With his experience being in a mastermind group with Dave Ramsey for 12 years, he digs into the importance of accountability, group trust, and commitment that make his current groups successful. He tells us what it takes to be a great mastermind group member and more!
Aaron: Hey, Rebekkah, thank you so much! It’s an honor to be here!
Bekkah: Our first question for you is what do you do?
Aaron: You know, I’m a life and business coach. I help ordinary men become extraordinary in all they do and we’ve started recently a year ago women’s masterminds as well. We help people accomplish their goals and dreams and live a successful and significant life.
Why Did You Become an Entrepreneur in Peer-to-Peer Mentorship?
Ruthie: Okay so why do you do that? What was your “why” behind getting started with peer-to-peer mentorship?
Aaron: Yeah that’s a great question. You know what I have found recently – when I say recently it’s two decades now so it’s not so recent – I found that we need people in our lives like we need camaraderie. We need insight. We need perspective and a lot of people have a hard time finding that and isolation is the enemy to excellence.
If we really want to take our life to the next level we’ve got to surround ourselves with competent trusted advisors that don’t have anything to gain or lose as a result of their input and they can help you push through upper limit challenges. They can help walk alongside you and encourage you and give you strength and that camaraderie that we all so desperately desire to help take your life to the next level. I don’t find it anywhere, any better than meeting in mastermind groups.
What Is The Definition of a Mastermind Group?
Bekkah: Can you give us a definition of what exactly is a mastermind group?
Aaron: Yeah it’s just peer-to-peer mentoring. You know, a lot of people equate it to a board of directors. Some people misunderstand what masterminding even means but it’s just where people have similar core values. They align themselves in a manner that they want to go forward and you do that best with people where you can coincide your core values along with theirs to catapult you to the next level. I just clearly say it’s your board of directors.
Ruthie: Alright. So let’s transition into the how do you do it portion. When you create a mastermind group what type of people are best fit to be a part of that?
Aaron: It depends on the mastermind group. You know we have found gender-neutral groups work well for some people. Some are gender-specific others, like ours, we cover 60% professional, 30% personal, and about 10% spiritual. Some people are a very niche market. Like we have some people that run mastermind groups that sell medical supplies for example. Or some people are architects or other people or housewives. It just depends on what you’re trying to accomplish as to the way you design the mastermind. Mastermind groups could be a number of things.
How Are Mastermind Groups Successful?
Bekkah: How do you see mastermind groups be successful?
Aaron: You know there again, it depends on the objective. It depends on what it is that you’re trying to accomplish. Most people are trying to move the ball down the field. They’re trying to have big wins. Like, in ours, we deal in five key areas of your life. We deal in your personal, relational, spiritual, financial, and professional. What we’ve seen to work very well is developing kind of a life plan and we usually do those in three-year increments.
We have a program that we design called “Come As You Will Be” and what we do is anticipate the vision in those five areas of your life. We design tasks that you need to do each and every day in order to be successful to accomplish your goal. Brian Moran teaches in the 12-week year, “When you will focus on the task rather than the goal, the goal takes care of itself.” So we just help hold you accountable each and every week to do the tasks that you should and shortly thereafter the goal follows.
How Do You Structure a Mastermind Group?
Ruthie: So tell us about the structure of your mastermind groups. You just said that you meet every week it sounds like.
Aaron: We meet on a platform called Zoom and it’s a virtual video platform. We have members now nine different countries from around the world. You know it’s pretty cool! We’ve got one guy that’s in Australia and it is tomorrow on our today and so we’re on the same call, two different countries on two different days.
It’s pretty cool that he’s that far ahead of us but the virtual-ness makes that possible. You don’t have to depend on local talent to meet in a mastermind when it’s virtual. You can select the people that you want to spend the most time with and get involved in a mastermind group so, yes, we meet virtually at the same time every single week and twice a year we meet in person.
Does Being Financially Invested in a Mastermind Group Impact Your Ability to Succeed?
Bekkah: I have another question for you about mastermind groups. I’ve looked at a bunch of different kinds in the past or whatever and if you form a mastermind group does being financially invested in it actually impact your ability to succeed?
Aaron: Oh, absolutely! Because we pay attention to what we pay for. If we’re not willing to pay for it, historically, some new shiny object comes along – a new client or an opportunity to play golf and you’ll probably default to that rather than showing up. But if you are vested financially more than likely you’re going to show up because you want to get your money’s worth. What we’ve seen is most people will pay attention more, simply for the reason that they’re vested.
Ruthie: Okay so what is the key to keeping people motivated in the groups that you lead?
Aaron: Yeah, well it depends on the objective and what you’re trying to accomplish because you’ve got to determine your “why”. Like you can say that I’ve got certain goals but if there’s not a bigger underlying “why” they probably won’t stay. We also assign accountability partners that we rotate through on a monthly basis so you have someone that’s texting you or calling you or emailing you or you’re getting on a video call once, twice, three times a week along with this accountability partner.
I know as well as you ladies do that you want to succeed and you don’t want to let that person down and you want to be sure that you’re accomplishing the things that you tell them that you want to do because nobody wants to show up and be a loser, right? We want to accomplish those things because we’ve got someone waiting on us or depending on us. Someone that is holding us accountable and so it’s a very big motivator.
The other thing is that we take turns rotating through these groups being the leader. Everyone wants to be the leader and so we rotate through being the leader. We have an accountability tool that we fill out every Thursday. It’s a digital tool. We ask you a series of questions and then the other members understand what it is that you’re trying to accomplish and they’re able to ask you on the following week’s call and so there are many, many things that we do in order to keep the motivation high.
What Is The Level of Contribution Required for a Mastermind Group?
Bekkah: Yeah so what should be the level of contribution that’s required of each person as they seek to be part of a mastermind group and how does that look?
Aaron: You know it depends on how fast you want to move the ball down the field. The more vested you are and the more involved and the more you reach out to cross-pollinate with other groups or other members in the same group. It opens up new opportunities because when you’re building relationships and you’re reaching out to people that just invites other opportunities. A lot of people sit back. They’re not as aggressive. They don’t push forward. They don’t reach out to other members in the group. They don’t cross-pollinate to other groups and if you’re really going to move the ball down the field you’ve got to get out there and seek the opportunities.
I’m very aggressive, personally, like I believe in making it happen and that’s the reason I’ve owned a number of businesses over the course of 42 years. I want to make things happen. This is like the only life that we’ve got, right? On this side of heaven, it’s all we’ve got and it’s not something that we’re doing a trial run. We’re living our life today and I want to maximize that and so I’m always looking for opportunities to reach out and to get new perspectives and for opportunities to present themselves. I’m very forward and I’m very aggressive and the more I do that the more opportunities open.
How to Be a Good Mastermind Group Participant
Ruthie: Okay, and that seems like it comes pretty natural to you, maybe? What about people who are stepping into this and maybe don’t have the same level of drive as you do? What does it look like to be a good mastermind group participant and how can you really bring value to the people that you’re working with?
Aaron: That’s a good question, Ruthie. What makes a good mastermind member is somebody that is really willing to understand a person well before they’re trying to be understood. We’re looking for givers not takers. We’re looking for somebody that is willing to share. Somebody that is willing to offer assistance, to edify you, to encourage you, to lift you up, to point out your blind spots. Not only encourage your superpowers but to say, “Hey! This is something that I see in you that maybe you don’t see in yourself,” because y’all know as well as I do other people see you differently than you see yourself.
Somebody that has a keen awareness of the areas in your life that you could maybe work on or you can improve on. I think it’s somebody that shows up on a regular basis. Somebody that is willing to spend time not just in the group but offline. Somebody that is willing to call you throughout the week not just at the appointed time. The truth is somebody that cares. Somebody that is really interested in your well-being and your welfare, that person makes an excellent mastermind member.
Bekkah: Yeah so it sounds like you have to have a high level of trust in order to share that kind of truth in a group. How does that work at the beginning? Do these people usually know each other beforehand or is it kind of something –
Aaron: No, never. They never know each other at first and it takes time. Just to be honest with you. We’ve had these groups running for years and years and years and historically when a new member comes it takes 60 to 90 days for them to start feeling comfortable. There’s a level of trust that starts to build over time. There’s really – when you’re meeting virtually people go more vulnerable and transparent faster than when they’re meeting in person in a community.
The reason is because – hypothetically let’s use this scenario: Let’s just say I’m in with Billy and Billy is in my community. Let’s just say I’m a banker and he’s a doctor. We’re in the group together. Well, our wives could play tennis together at the local country club. Well, I’m probably a little more hesitant to share anything personal. Maybe there’s something going on in my life with Robin, my wife, and I’m a little hesitant to share because our wives play tennis together and you can see the repercussions that could happen. But if I’m in Texas and he’s in Nashville there’s no correlation. There’s no connection. I’m apt to share quicker because there’s not that fear that the thing I’m sharing about is going to escape from that conversation.
The other thing is the level of competition. A lot of people have a mindset of “If I share this, I’m going to share the secret sauce,” but if there’s no sense of competition you’re willing to share with people more because you don’t feel that it will encroach on your business. You can talk more about family members because there’s no connection. There’s no one that has a connection in your local community so you’re just able to share deeper faster when you’re doing it virtually.
You just have to learn to trust over time. A lot of the groups sign non-disclosure agreements that you can’t discuss anything outside of the group. Some people sign a commitment of confidentiality and then the other thing is just there’s an agreement. It’s just when you join, the things that we talk about are confidential and if you ever divulge that it’s the surest, fastest way to get voted off the island like you’re not coming back if we find out you’re sharing this. It’s a very, very safe place historically.
Is it Beneficial to Have a Variety of Backgrounds in a Mastermind Group?
Bekkah: What would you say, is it beneficial or not to have a variety of backgrounds and ages in a mastermind group or does it make it the same if everyone’s around the same level of experience?
Aaron: Yeah, no. I think diversity is really what we’re looking for because I may have a great amount of experience in one area because of my age but maybe I need technology education and maybe somebody much younger can help me accomplish that. Maybe I do well at making money but my relationships are not doing well. See there’s no age barrier there. A lot of people that are young have a lot of experience in building relationships.
Maybe someone is new relatively in their marriage but Robin and I now have 41 years of marriage and I can offer a lot of insight there. We can always reach back to a mentee or we can always look forward to a mentor. There’s always people that can help us in every demographic of our life. We have people in our groups today that are just starting they’re entrepreneurs or maybe they’re solopreneurs but we have other people that have hundreds of employees that do multI-millions of dollars in revenue annually that can really lead people on who are aspiring to do the same. I think the diversification is very good.
How Do You Hand the Exclusivity of a Mastermind Group?
Bekkah: How do you handle the exclusivity of mastermind groups? Where’s the line between being in a group that’s encouraging to one another and then where is the treading lightly to not become like a good-old-boys or good-old-girls club? How do you make people feel welcomed?
Aaron: Yeah that’s a great question. Well, first of all I don’t think anybody should be at a point where they feel that someone is better than someone else from an exclusivity standpoint. I’m Christian by faith and I feel like God created everyone equal. There are some people that happen to be more fortunate financially but that certainly doesn’t put you in a position of authority or exclusivity that would create an environment where someone would feel they were maybe better than someone else. We’re very careful with that.
Now, everyone can’t afford to be in a mastermind group and I get that. Everyone can be in community and until you can be in a group that you can afford to pay for, I would encourage everyone strongly to be in a group, a local group even or you can be in a virtual group. It doesn’t have to be a paid group that you’re in, but you asked earlier where I found the most devotion. The most devotion are the people that are paying. Now I’ve got children older than both of you and I’ve learned years ago that they need to have a vested interest in things in order for them to pay attention.
For example, I didn’t give my children their first car. They had to work for it. I matched what they contributed but I didn’t pay for the car. A lot of people are getting education today. I have found that people really pay attention to getting out of school faster when they’re paying for it. If their dad’s paying for it or their mom’s paying for it sometimes it’s a little easier to take your time, right? “I got another year,” but if you’ve got a vested interest in anything, historically, this is not true for everybody, but, historically, you’re going to maintain it better. You’re going to look after it. You’re going to take care of it because someone else is not footing the bill. The same way with the mastermind groups.
When you’re paying your hard-earned money to be in there you’re going to show up, you’re going to participate, you’re going to reach out, you’re going to get all you can. If there’s no cost, there’s no pain and you’re able to go play golf today or you’re able to go shopping today rather than showing up on your mastermind. Someone’s getting cheated, right?
The people that are there that you said you were going to commit to. They’re showing up to hear what you have to say, so not only are you being cheated but the people that you committed to being there you’re cheating. I’ve just seen, historically – this is not true for everybody listening because I do realize some people who are meeting. Their groups are amazing and they’re not paying. That’s an anomaly. That’s not the standard and so I would just suggest that if you want to get into a group where everyone’s participating in equally – I would suggest a paid group.
How to Handle Imposter Syndrome When Being in a Mastermind Group
Ruthie: Yeah and I’ve seen that pretty consistently across the board with most things in life. There’s a difference between free and something you have to pay for and the level of commitment for sure. How do you kind of grapple with that sense of imposter syndrome when you enter into a mastermind group if you aren’t someone who has had a lot of experience and you’re kind of stepping into this room with people who have been – like what you were describing like you’ve been married for over 40 years and have a ton of experience in running so many different businesses. How do you handle imposter syndrome?
Aaron: Well, Ruthie, the truth is we all deal with imposter syndrome to some level. You know sometimes I’ll lay in bed and I’ll be talking to Robin and somebody will have quit our mastermind and I’ll say, “Do you think anybody else is going to join our mastermind group?” She’ll say, “Shut up and go to sleep! What are you talking about?” It’s like, you know, I’m a coach also and “is anybody going to hire me to be their coach,” and she’s like, “You’ve owned 14 businesses! Sure somebody else is going to call you!” and see I’m like, “Oh, man, but I don’t know every answer to every question,” right? We all deal with that. I don’t care what level you’re at. We’ve dealt with people at the highest income bracket you can get and they even still wrestle with the imposter syndrome sometimes.
Gay Hendricks wrote a great book called “The Big Leap” and it talks about pushing through these upper limit challenges. The truth is, we’re all knuckleheads, we all have those upper limit challenges that we have to deal with and that’s all the more reason you need a mastermind group. You need people to walk you through that to help you. Listen we’re all at different stages. We’re all at different levels – everyone.
I’ve written two books. I’m about to write a third book, Ken Abraham sat to my left in my mastermind group. Dave Ramsey said to my right and Dave and I have been friends now for 30 years. I started with Dave when he first started on the air. I was his second sponsor. I sponsored his show for 21 consecutive years and so we’ve been friends since the very beginning. Someone said I needed to write a book and I said, “Well, Ken Abraham that sat on my left for a dozen years he was the most prolific and still is ghost author on the planet. Anybody that’s anybody he’s written their book.”
Dave Ramsey sitting on the right had written a dozen books at this time and sold tens of millions of copies and I said, “Who’s going to read my book? I mean like who am I they’re going to read my book?” and then Ken Davis said, “No, you’re writing the book for the wrong reason. If you’re writing the book to compare yourself with someone else you’ll never win because there’s always somebody a step ahead of you. You need to write the book because it’s going to impact somebody’s life, right?”
It was great advice and it really helped me to push through that. I spent the next 18 months writing “View From the Top” and I help people now accomplish a level of success and significance in their life and the people that have read that book said, “Man, this is an amazing book!” If I had used that imposter syndrome or I had used that “it’s not as good as theirs” I wouldn’t have created the book “View From the Top” and so we just have to all stay in our lane because God uniquely created every person for a purpose, for a task, and we’ve just got to keep our focus on that.
What Advice Do You Have for Younger People Who Are Looking For Peer Mentors?
Bekkah: What resources would you recommend and the second part of that is what would you give as advice to younger people who are looking for peer mentors?
Aaron: Yeah I would just say to go slowly, right? And to reach out and not be afraid to approach someone that you admire, someone you respect. I think one of the key elements is that if they don’t have similar core values to you. No way I would enlist them to be my mentor. For me, personally, I’ll just share to give an example like I have five core values. My first core value is “relationships matter most.” That’s the first core value I have regardless of the decision I’m making; “the relationship matters most.”
The second thing is I don’t want to do anything halfway. I want to make it amazing. Everything I do I try to give it everything I’ve got. Now it’s not always amazing compared to something else but it’s not for the lack of effort; it’s I just don’t know any better but I’m gonna make it as amazing as I can. The third core value for me is no excuses. I hate excuses. Like everybody’s got an excuse. They’re a victim or whatever. I’m like, “Man, I’m in charge of my success, right?” Not a presidential candidate not other peers like it’s me. There are no excuses and the fourth one is everything is figure-out-able.
I believe everything that we do is figure-out-able now. From a faith perspective some things may be a mystery and we shouldn’t figure it out but humanly speaking I think everything is “figureoutable.” Then my last core value is “truth before opinion” and I think that we’ve really got to establish what truth is for me. It’s looking through the biblical lens to discover any truth and find our identity before someone’s opinion. If you can find other peers that align with your core values, that’s the person that you want to mentor you so go out search for people look for people that align in your core values and then start hanging out!
Ruthie: Wow! That’s so good. I love that you talked about your core value. Bekkah and I are always bringing up the value of that and making decisions for the rest of your life really and how that determines things.
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